Return of the (Lack of) XP Rollover! [BUG]

Discussion in 'Conquest of the Wizardlands' started by InnocuousJoe, Aug 2, 2012.

  1. InnocuousJoe

    InnocuousJoe Member

    2500/2000 after killing the baron, 0/2000 once I selected a skill :-(

    No more XP rollover on purpose, thereby requiring super precise killing of mobs (in order to not waste thousands of XP), or bug?
  2. Frelus

    Frelus Member

    It was always that way....
  3. Lorrelian

    Lorrelian Member

    This. I would definitely like to see XP rollover, however. Particularly with the early minibosses frequently pushing me over the level mark by 25-50%.
  4. Frelus

    Frelus Member

    Yep, I want to have it, too.
    Maybe with diminishing returns, like -1/4 after the first level up and for more levelups -1/4 of the previous value...
  5. Psiweapon

    Psiweapon Member

    I really don't get this, at all.

    -Each particular level needs a finite amount of exp to reach.

    -Each monster surely gives a finite amount of exp,
    -maybe taking character level as a factor​

    Cutting an arbitrary amount out of a monster's granted exp just because it happens to be the one that takes you over the XP cap for that level, is at best a piece of ad-hoc ruling, and at worst a weird kludge.

    Not like that's a capital sin or anything, every game has its kludges, but still they should be avoided.

    Why not use a simple rule of three?

    -X% of the XP reward "overflows" the XP meter.

    -That same event* would yield Y experience when killed at the next character level

    -Therefore, X% of Y is added to the next level XP meter

    (if it overflows again, that overflow can be expressed as Z% of Y, apply Z% to the next level XP reward, and add that to the next XP meter.)

    All that would hold if monster XP scales down with character level, which I don't know, if it's the XP meter what gets bigger at each character level, why not just hose the character with the XP and let him/her reap as many levels as it's worth? What's bad in that?

    Anything else somehow seems contrary to reason, at least from my perspective. This may sound lacking in humility but I just can't help thinking that this (or something similar) would be the most sensible solution.

    I hope I didn't just fail@maths.
  6. Frelus

    Frelus Member

    This was likely done to prevent Archaeology + something like finding a Crownstar Addendum bringing you to the levelcap on DL1.
    Of course, I also want it to lapse, maybe with diminishing returns, as it is a singleplayer game and no one cares what level you are - except yourself.
  7. Kazeto

    Kazeto Member

    A simple answer for you - "It Belongs to the Museum".

    Think what would happen if experience did roll over. And since it mostly hits people who use the above-mentioned skill, here you have it.

    It is possible that it will be changed in the future, mind you, but that requires making appropriate modifications to that skill first. And originally, it was put here to stop situations where people got two or more levels at once because of weird experience bar behaviour.
  8. Psiweapon

    Psiweapon Member

    You point out my ignorance, what's wrong with "it belongs to the museum" ?
  9. Frelus

    Frelus Member

    As I said, Crownstar Addendums and co. being gotten on DL 1 from fountains.
    They really should stop people from losing them in there...
  10. Shwqa

    Shwqa Member

    I really don't think crownstar+museuming is that big of a problem. Getting that item on floor 1 is incredibly rare. Hell I think the crownstar itself is more useful because you would get the level in time but the crownstar is an end game equipment.
    banjo2E likes this.
  11. Kazeto

    Kazeto Member

    I don't know about "ignorance" (I didn't use that word in my previous post, and I don't think of you as an ignorant type), but the problem with "It Belongs to the Museum" is that with experience rolling over and with some basic luck it could be used to get level 50 by the time you are on 4th or 5th floor. And that would make Archaeology overpowered in comparison to other skill trees, which is a bad thing and I don't think I have to say why.
  12. Daynab

    Daynab Community Moderator Staff Member

    This was never "fixed", for what it's worth, I'm not sure what the official word is on it.
  13. dbaumgart

    dbaumgart Art Director Staff Member

    Thought I answered this, maybe it was a different thread.

    Issue is known and recorded. Used to have a ticket from a long long time ago but it looks like it got lost in the transition from our old bugtracker to our new bugtracker. I made a new one and it's slated for the next major patch.
    banjo2E likes this.
  14. Psiweapon

    Psiweapon Member

    Oh, c'mon, my ignorance on the subject at hand. Let me rephrase it: "I didn't have any idea that sending artifacts back to the scary warehouse full of boxes was broken" and "What the hell is that crownstar addendum" ?

    Don't make a big deal out of it,

    Can't this be dealt with changing the way "It Belongs to the Museum" works or the way some items work, instead of a tweaking the entire XP system?
  15. InnocuousJoe

    InnocuousJoe Member

    Heh, so I went to dinner/sleep/did some stuff after I posted this...

    Anyways, I definitely thought I remembered this being fixed: I think the reason I noticed is that I've been playing more No Time To Grind, where a lack of XP rollover is substantially more noticeable. Oh, well.
  16. Kazeto

    Kazeto Member

    I'm not making a big deal out of your alleged ignorance. You want to know, you just ask, and we answer - it's as simple as that, and whether you didn't knew before because you didn't need it or because you didn't care is irrelevant.
    Besides, that trope doesn't really apply here, unless you want to tell me it was not because of supposed ignorance, but because you flat out didn't care (which I don't want to think could be the case).

    Which is why I wrote "It is possible that it will be changed in the future, mind you, but that requires making appropriate modifications to that skill first." in my first reply here. They are planning on making changes to "It Belongs to the Museum", and as I also wrote in my first reply here (it appears to be some sort of trend, weirdly), "And originally, it was put here to stop situations where people got two or more levels at once because of weird experience bar behaviour.", aka. it was changed so that people would stop experiencing a weird bug that caused them to gain two or more levels at the same time on occasions.
  17. banjo2E

    banjo2E Member

    This. Fountains drop an item of any quality like 1 time out of 100, and the only other way to find a Crownstar on DL1 is to steal it from Brax, IF he has one, which is still really unlikely. And you've still got to escape Brax and his minions, which is generally rather difficult with DL1 equipment, even if you are level 20. And if you manage to pull all of that off, you deserve to have those levels, because that means you have either a one-in-a-million amount of luck or a slightly more reasonable amount of luck and a great deal of skill.

    The double-level bug is the main reason XP doesn't roll over at the moment; it's a bit irksome but I can understand why it's implemented the way it is. (Currently the game's set up so that you level whenever you earn XP and it pushes you above the amount you need to level; killing multiple monsters with one spell when you were close to the cap would sometimes let you level two or even three times in as many seconds.)
  18. InnocuousJoe

    InnocuousJoe Member

    So maybe you can clear this up for me: why is double leveling a all? It should be an easy fix, since they know how much XP is required for each level up, to adjust to the highest possible level, provide that many skill points, and move on. Your character sheet already adjusts stats whenever you skill-up, so doing it multiple times in a row shouldn't be an issue...should it?
  19. banjo2E

    banjo2E Member

    Dredmor's XP system is...special. If you have 500 out of 500 XP you don't level up, for instance. Leveling up actually resets your XP pool; the number displayed in the bar at the bottom is the only number the XP system actually uses. Adding rollover would involve adding more numbers and other things and would be a fair amount of work to fix a thing that works mostly OK when there's things that are currently completely broken like cooldowns not decreasing until you save and reload and charmed/pet monsters never casting spells.

    Also as dbaumgart said above the devs changed bug trackers and apparently the knowledge of this bug was one of the casualties of the transition.
  20. dbaumgart

    dbaumgart Art Director Staff Member

    .... The second part of the comment I thought I made before is that the XP gain from Archaeology is also slated for revision.