Hidden sword recipes ver1.05

Discussion in 'Bugs' started by sairus, Sep 9, 2011.

  1. sairus

    sairus Member

    I played a lot of time, my hero lvl 12 and im on 5 floor
    i have a lot of various hidden recipes, but no one hidden sword recipes
    its ok?
    its a critical for me, because i take sword skill
  2. jzworkman

    jzworkman Member

    You dont need the recipe. Check how to craft different swords on dredmorwiki.com
  3. sairus

    sairus Member

    ohh, thx
    but i think its not good, i mean craft without recipe
  4. Vykk Draygo

    Vykk Draygo Member

    Really? I don't think it's a bug. It's pretty useful to craft recipes that you know from memory. I often never find anything pertaining to my skill choices.
  5. Psiweapon

    Psiweapon Member

    Earlier I found a Steeled Robe recipe I wish I had taken a closer look to, or had the correct tool...
  6. neocow

    neocow Member

    Psiweapon, You can still view it from any recipe container. just click on the alchemy box after you are in the recipe-viewer.
    (Steeled robe is alchemy)
  7. Psiweapon

    Psiweapon Member

    Thanks for reminding, but I didn't have the correct tool... or any other one, for that matter. And anyways that character's already dead.
  8. Derakon

    Derakon Member

    I'd like to see recipes be kept across games, or else items you don't have the recipe for be uncraftable. Though in the latter case, access to crafting recipes would have to be seriously rethought, since practically speaking that'd be a huge nerf for crafting skills.
  9. IanExMachina

    IanExMachina Member

    I'd like it to be made that without the recipe you can't craft the item.

    I mean there are a huge amount of bookcases now and part of the Roguelike is random luck.
  10. mr.ioes

    mr.ioes Member

    You can craft anything without having the recipe? damn...
  11. 123stw

    123stw Member

    Only if they unhide Ring of Iron Thorn

    Otherwise there are no reason to pick Smith at all.
  12. IanExMachina

    IanExMachina Member

    Well apart from the weapons and armour you can craft?
  13. 123stw

    123stw Member

    What weapons/armors are you talking about? Serpentine (2 recipes), Katana, Knightly Sword, Flail of Pleiades, Runed Iron Hjalmr, they are all hidden, meaning you most likely won't get them.

    All the good weapons/armors are hidden, and from every run I did thus far it is easier finding the item itself than the actual recipe. It's easier finding a serpentine armor than the 2 recipes, easier to find a decent sword than the katana recipe. Take all those away you can still probably find them on the floor, take Ring of Iron Thorn away and you almost guarantee not to find them.

    In fact, the chance of finding any one specific recipe DECREASED since 1.05 because of the new 18 hidden junk recipe they added in. Yes even the increased bookshelf doesn't mean anything when you want 1 specific items, because recipe in shelf can overlap. This means every bookshelf is a gamble of 1/total hidden recipes, square that for serpentine. If you think the increase book shelf will give you most the recipes you are dead wrong. It just give you tons of overlaps.

    Either they unhide ring of iron thorn, or make sure the book shelf do not generate recipe you already received.

    So yeah it's not worth 4 levels and 1 tree for whatever non hidden weapon/armor you can craft.
  14. IanExMachina

    IanExMachina Member

    I've always found myself with enough ingots to craft better weapons/armour from the base before I've found better alternatives.

    I think focussing in a roguelike upon one particular item might not be that wise tbh, as everything is random.
  15. 123stw

    123stw Member

    You are ignoring 4 points and a tree into that skill. All the non hidden equipments can easily be compensated by throwing those 4 points elsewhere, which continues to work for the whole game.

    The whole point of crafting is to reduce the random, for 4 levels and a tree. If it cannot provide that I might as well just get another offensive or defensive skill. Adding 4 points in anything else will at least ensure I get the exact bonus I wanted. I don't get random skills when I put points into Sword, Burglary, or Master of Arm, why then, should 4 points in crafting skill have the high chance of being completely useless?

    Smith, Tinker, or melee characters in general, are hardly OP. I don't see any reason that justifies a hard nerf on them.
  16. IanExMachina

    IanExMachina Member

    I'd argue that it isn't a nerf, as the game wasn't designed round going to a wiki page of recipes, it would be fixing it.

    As to the point expenditure, yes as you level the skill you create better items so you have to commit to it. As to whether the equipment is compensated by other skills it depends, a few more points in Swords is a few more points of damage, a few more points in smithing is the ability to radically increase the damage past that level.

    Also the crafting skills give passive bonuses as well.
  17. 123stw

    123stw Member

    Regardless rather you want to use the word "nerf" or not, this change will significantly weaken Crafting skill. Anyone can see that. Hence there's no point arguing about the terminology.

    The only justification to make things "weaker" is if it's "overpowered". Having an unforeseen utility does not justify this if the skill remains balanced.

    As for "just a few points". Remember that the benefit of craft = crafted equipment minus items you picked up. So 4 more sword skill + weaker items can easily compensate for the "unhidden" stuff even at the first few floors. Beyond which you can easily find better items than those bronze armor or iron helm.

    I stand by the statement that Smith and Tinker are currently balance. If "people shouldn't have to rely on wiki", then the ideal fix is to simply reveal all recipe at the start.
  18. Derakon

    Derakon Member

    "I'd argue that it isn't a nerf, as the game wasn't designed round going to a wiki page of recipes, it would be fixing it."
    How do you know? The devs are surely aware that they're designing a game in the Internet Age. Information of all types is readily available. If they'd really wanted to make it impossible to use recipes that you haven't found yet, that's like a two- or three-line change. They could have done it easily.

    It's been over a decade since that excuse had any merit for PC games. Anyone who writes a game without assuming that fans will dissect it and post the innards for all to see is either intending for their game to be unpopular, or simply delusional.
  19. Psiweapon

    Psiweapon Member

    It has been done before, sort of.

    Castlevania Symphony of the night has "spells" that do all sort of crazy stuff (let you heal when blood splashes you, throw fireballs, whatever.

    They're sold in the store in the castle, for a hefty price. The catch is... what they're selling you is the button press sequence you must input to cast the spell.

    If you remember the sequences, they're added to yout list the first time you succesfully input them, removing the need to buy them.

    (spell <-> recipe /\ buying them <-> finding a recipe)
  20. IanExMachina

    IanExMachina Member

    ^^ & ^^^
    Fair enough I assumed that the game wasn't designed so crafting was based upon wiki reading, as well why bother with hidden recipes?

    I wouldn't say it would weaken it personally, as I've never found it lacking, it gives a Burliness boost and you can craft decent unhidden recipes, you don't always find the best weapons and armour randomly. However of course that is my personal view on it's usefulness.

    I'm not sure about the sword comparison, you'd get 1 proc, one skill move, and a few extra points of damage. Whilst there is slightly more versatility from the skill move you can easy increase the damage higher with better crafted equipment.