A God am I - Egyptian Magic

Discussion in 'Conquest of the Wizardlands' started by Psiweapon, Aug 7, 2012.

  1. Psiweapon

    Psiweapon Member

    Does anybody else feel like this?

    I've hit the Egyptian Magic capstone a couple of levels ago, and with Sandstorm and Eye of Ra buff, I'm pretty much curbstomping anything. And thanks to ley walker, I don't have many mana problems.
  2. shaken

    shaken Member

    Yes, I had the same experience with a fully capped out Egyptian Magic and Ley Lines to the penultimate skill (though I probably only needed Thaumaturgic Tap, the extra mana regen just makes it a smoother experience). Obliterated Zoos in 2-3 casts of Sandstorm on DL4.
  3. Psiweapon

    Psiweapon Member

    Yes, I just killed Brax.

    I was trying to lift a Kronghammer from him at the ice level (It's got a crafting bonus on it, I WANT IT), peacefully, exploiting the Pocket Dimension.

    I swear, agent, I was trying to spatially infuse my way out of there, when accidentally a steam rocket bolt misclicked into his face. Then he was after my hide, what else was I supposed to do? He's got a lot of other incarnations!
  4. dbaumgart

    dbaumgart Art Director Staff Member

    Oh there shall be a nerfing in the next major patch, believe me!
  5. I've survived off of booze and thaumaturgic tap alone. (And blood magic)

    I'm curious how well this scales to later levels though. Capstone spells (and sandstorm with eye of ra counts as a capstone spell) probably SHOULD be obliterating stuff on level four if you can consistantly use it.

    How overpowered does it seem on level 14 though would be the question?

    Well I suppose that answers that question :p
  6. Psiweapon

    Psiweapon Member

    Damn! My game crashed trying to exit the pocket dimension!!!!


    Now I'll be, at best, trapped in the pocket dimension and the wizardlands! This is the second time it happens to the same character!!!

    Well, at least I know that not even Brax can staind against the almighty power of the Eye of Ra. At least until the nerfing comes.
  7. doorhandle

    doorhandle Member

    I third this. Egyptian magic is basically unstoppable, and in my opinion what viking magic should have been.

    I mean, come on! Glyphs could be replaced with runes! it would totally work!
  8. Borodin

    Borodin Member

    Expected. Just remember to reduce the extremely heavy cost of sandstorms when you reduce the too powerful effect of that Sandstorm spell with all glyphs running. Otherwise we'll end up with a less potent spell and such overwhelming costs that it's not worth going for the skill.
  9. shaken

    shaken Member

    They could add an effect to the +Glyph effects on Sandstorm that drains a flat 2 mana or so per effect. Then they could balance the base Sandstorm to be a reasonable cost, and it gets a flat increase in cost per additional effect. That sounds good to me, thoughts?
    Psiweapon likes this.
  10. Psiweapon

    Psiweapon Member

    Sounds good. And remember that it should have like 2 or 3 more procs that don't actually happen right now (unless you have Lunix's patch I think)
  11. Robsbot

    Robsbot Member

    I would like to ask for careful balancing on this. So far I haven't really ever disagreed with what you guys have done with balance but this tree and Necronomiconomics are my favorite Primary damage tree. Both have a heavy cost which is what makes the gameplay so rewarding.

    I've never been able to reliably run with egyptian magic shy of about DL4. The cost of the upkeeps are so strong they will actually drain your mana with even two up until you have a high level of Ley Walker and some Magic Regen gear. I love that. The physically limiting aspect of the tree coupled with the sheer power makes it fun to play and build around. I'd like to keep the power level as is, so maybe a worse trade off is necessary. What about making each glyph cost 1/4 upkeep? This way unless you are regen capped it will destroy your mana pool if you try to run around and use a full glyphed sandstorm as a bread and butter skill tree. That would make it so you'd either have to take skill trees that give you alternative methods of regen or gimp you with a heavy reliance on booze. Casting costs of the glyphs should remain high (with little to know cost reduction) to discourage dumping them all on, spraying sandstorm, and then dropping them all to beat the regen penalty.

    I need to experiment with what effects the different glyphs give to the Sandstorm spell. I usually just slap on the glyphs when I level them. Maybe then I could better suggest some points for fine tuning for you guys. I also haven't dug past the double digit dungeon levels with Egyptian magic, so those two things will be on my list to test.
  12. Borodin

    Borodin Member

    I like it--for the Sandstorm as it is. But if the Sandstorm becomes less effective, the cost should be proportionally lower. I suppose we'll just have to see whether they choose to keep the power and jack up the costs (my preferred route), or lower the power and lower the costs. Personally, I'd rather see the power kept, and the drain with all glyphs running be absolutely prohibitive to more than a couple of casts at full glyphs even with special gear and Blood Magic running. Perhaps even add an immobilize effect for X turns per cast.
    Robsbot likes this.
  13. Robsbot

    Robsbot Member

    Interesting, so you're a fan of each glyph having like, a 1/3 upkeep or worse? This would drain 1.3 mana per turn, absolutely wrecking your mana base for any long term use. You'd have to tap on cooldown, take the one from Magic Training, and then probably still need a heavy booze / blood magic reliance. I thought 1/4 per Glyph was a bit too rough for some people and possibly overdoing it.

    I like your style.

    Or did I interpret this all wrong and you're moreso going for the sandstorm change quoted in your post?
  14. Penguins

    Penguins Member

    I honestly hope they don't choose to just make the costs crazy high. This seems like it would become much more limited in how it could be used (in terms of build). If I went Egyptian there would be no choice other than grabbing blood magic and ley walker at the very least and probably magic training as well. Choosing the alternative path of weakening the damage somewhat means that is possible to look to Egyptian magic in some other builds.
  15. Robsbot

    Robsbot Member

    That's really the point of Primary damage trees like Promethean Magic, Egyptian Magic, and Necronomiconomics. They aren't utility trees. They are your go to damage spells for mage classes. I don't like the idea of any builds being able to splash Wizard class Primary spell trees and get all of the damage benefits without devoting at least some gear and a few other Wizard support skills to supplement the tree. If you want to splash magic, I find it more acceptable that other trees should be used for utility or leveling ease. Why should a warrior be able to splash a Wizard Primary damage tree when a Wizard cannot splash one or two skills and be as effective in melee as a warrior?

    EDIT: This is all opinion, of course.
  16. shaken

    shaken Member

    Because if that Warrior is just "splashing" a Wizard skill line, then he likely isn't going to be gearing for Magic Power, and thus won't get the same kind of damage out of that skill line. I don't think a Warrior splashing Egyptian Magic for the nice buffs and heal is too far a stretch as long as the damage values for Sandstorm are scaled in such a way that a Warrior gearing as a Warrior won't be able to obliterate zoos with Sandstorm.
  17. Robsbot

    Robsbot Member

    There's plenty of other trees like that. Fleshsmithing does the exact same thing (heal, buff, AOE) and is scaled properly for splashing. Wizards should have some trees that give more benefit but require a much stronger investment. And again, Wizards really can't be good at melee at all (due to several in game mechanics, most noteworthy counter chance). Why should Warriors be good at magic at all with just a small investment?
  18. shaken

    shaken Member

    The mana upkeep for the spells alone makes it very difficult for a Warrior to splash it and still make substantial use of Sandstorm. My point is, the Warrior won't be able to splash Egyptian Magic and be "good at magic" as you say, without a heavy investment. You think the investment is small, but in order for a Warrior to make good use of Egyptian Magic (to even a comparable degree that a Wizard build would) you would need to either 1) equip Wizard gear, gimping your Warrior ability, or 2) take a few other Wizard trees to supplement your mana regen, such as Blood Magic and Ley Lines, but even with Ley Lines you would need to be careful in your gearing to not gimp your mana regen. This is the situation with Egyptian Magic currently, and we know a change is coming, a nerf even, so it will likely get even more difficult for a Warrior to splash it.

    But a Warrior can still get good use out of the numerous buffs that Egyptian Magic brings, so I think it should be feasible to splash it, after all is said and done. We just need to be careful to not let them use Sandstorm in the same way that Wizards do.
    Robsbot likes this.
  19. Frelus

    Frelus Member

    I would like to contest the notion of wizards being bad in melee.
    Some of the best melee build are wizard/rogue builds without warrior levels.
    Stuff like Necro, Viking, Demon and (now) daggers is very strong in melee, along with healing skills (alchemy) this is superior to most warriors, especially since it can still do much ranged damage.
    mining likes this.
  20. Borodin

    Borodin Member

    I'd rather see a slightly more subtle increase in upkeep--perhaps 25%--a much greater expenditure of mana on a Sandstorm cast (dependent upon the number of active glyphs), and something like immobilization, while keeping the power of the Sandstorm. You want a great area damage spell? You pay with a lot of mana, upkeep and spell cost, and then you also have the side effects to consider. A cooldown isn't one of them by my way of thinking, because half the fun of using Sandstorms is that you can spam them. Just remember that doing so requires a lot of booze and blood magic both, plus being stuck in one space in case something wanders in you didn't expect. So you get the effect you want, but you lose a chunk of your arm and your heart and your left leg, maybe, too.
    Robsbot likes this.