Project: Community Skills Guide

Discussion in 'Dungeons of Dredmor General' started by Lorrelian, Apr 14, 2012.

  1. OmniaNigrum

    OmniaNigrum Member

    Like it or not, once we start talking about DW as a skill we will absolutely require talking about each and every weapon skill again. Keeping them separate makes no sense to me.

    Does Berserker Rage belong here too? I take it when making a heavy melee skill build. I also take Assassination every time I take Berserker Rage. As a matter of fact, I think Assassination, Berserker Rage, Dual Wield, any weapon skill or two and a few other skills chosen for themselves makes an awesome melee combatant.

    I usually make mod based characters. So the above is only relevant here. It is a build I have not tried in a long time.

    Since half the people here insist upon speaking only of half the subject, I will play stupid too. I like Staves best by far. They are the best of all worlds at current. There are some nice weapons of each type, but far more staves with decent stats and procs than any other type. Second to that is probably maces, followed by a defense themed unarmed build.
  2. mining

    mining Member

    My take: Weapon skills are generally a trap, but Unarmed is the best by a mile - it means you can hunker down behind two Universal Principles or two strong shields and tank a zoo one monster at a time. Further, its usables are knockbacks, further strengthening it.
  3. Lorrelian

    Lorrelian Member

    *sigh* Again, we're not talking about overall archetypes. If you want a build thread, make a build thread. If you want to note a synergy, note a synergy. I said in my post that Dual Wielding double the bonuses, didn't I? But you don't need a weapon skill to take Dual Wielding, you don't need Dual Wielding to take a weapon skill. I've done both and had good runs.

    Dual Wielding makes everything I said about the weapon skills (other than unarmed) apply twice. That's the bonus between DW and weapon skills. But DW is much, much deeper than that. When we talk about DW, I fully intend to mention its synergy with weapon skills again. That's part of a comprehensive guide. You do repeat yourself. Some people are just going to want one piece of information when they reference it, they won't read the whole thing, so that's necessary. But they don't want to read a comprehensive melee strategy analysis when they just want to know how Maces works in a vacuum.

    I've been working in a Library for four and a half years, I know how people act when they have an information request, trust me when I say this is going to be the best format for most of them (not necessarily you, but the majority of people). Some of them will probably read the whole thing, yes. But most? No. They'll look at one skill. They'll want to see Dual Wielding and Weapons Skills separate. 40% or more will probably be upset to see all the weapon skills lumped together, but that's tough. This way saves time. =/
  4. Shwqa

    Shwqa Member

    Before anyone gets a little too defensive about how to do this, I just want to remind everyone this is a silly little indie game about a large eyebrowed adventurer trying to kill a lich, who was killed by another large eyebrowed adventurer that looks just like you, in a world filled with puns and references.
    FaxCelestis, Marak, mining and 2 others like this.
  5. Lorrelian

    Lorrelian Member

    OP now contains updated PDF! We've covered two mage skills and five warrior skills. I'd like to do a pair of rogue skills now, then another mage skill. Today is Fungal Arts, I'm open to suggestions for Friday and next Tuesday. Also, don't hesitate to start on a skill just because I'm a lazy git who over slept instead of posting in the morning like he totally intended to the night before...

    Fungal Arts
    Type: Rogue
    Role: Turbocharger or Fuel Tank
    Fungal Arts is a skill that can be used to greatly increase the effectiveness of other skills or as a way to stave off the crippling effects of attrition through the long slog to DL15.
    Theme: Life From the Dead
    This skill sometimes makes mushrooms on the corpses of dead enemies, and gives a lot of mushroom themed powers like pets and spore clouds.
    The basic idea behind this skill is simple: Kill enemies (which you were going to do already), occasionally get shrooms. Level up, put points in the skill, get shrooms more frequently. ???? Profit. While Fungal Arts needs to be maxed early for maximum value, there's no denying that it can help just about any build, from melee tanks to dedicated mages. Perhaps only a serious crossbow user gets nothing from this skill.
    There are literally mushrooms for anything. Basic and exotic damage resistance, more melee damage, life leech, healing, mana regen, casting bonuses, ranged AoE stunning, you name it. Moldsmithing lets you turn mushrooms you can't use into mushrooms you can use. Sure, there's a "dead end" in the ability, but you're still getting tons of shrooms for free. Plus you get Toxic Resistance. Toxic Damage is the most common damage type in the game. Not on a single floor, in the game. And you can resist five points of it once this skill is maxed out. That's almost like having a second suit of armor. Oh, and pets. It gives you sort of useful pets too.
    The skill requires a lot of clicking to maximize. Sure, spores are gone (do you even remember spores?) but Moldsmith still requires some patience, and you may find your inventory open more often than you like. With the exception of the Mob Bonnet, the Night Cap, the Greedy Blucap and the Fairywodger, most of the mushrooms don't scale well to the end game. But hey, that's still four very useful items, right?
    This skill adds a little something to just about everything. It also gives a non-mage character enormous late game reach by solving many healing issues. However, if you don't like puttering around in your inventory a great deal or find yourself agonizing over what is the best way to maximize a small number of marginally advantageous buffs when you could be enjoying the game, you might want to leave it on the shelf.
  6. Essence

    Essence Will Mod for Digglebucks

    The thing about Fungal Arts is that on a well-built character, it makes an excellent 'throwaway' seventh skill. Even without any points in it, you automatically get access to the Fairywodger and the Inky Hoglantern, meaning a single point in Fungal Arts is virtually all a Warrior-class needs to survive to low levels.

    You have to put 1 point into it in order to get access to the full gamut of mushrooms (of note, the Greedy Blungecap, Azure Mob-Bonnet, and Odious Puffball aren't available out of the gate), but it makes a great first skill to put a point into -- the slime pet is a huge boost to clearing level 1, especially for a mage. Once you have that one point in Fungal Arts, you never need to worry about it again. Sell or Fisk the crappy mushrooms, and just hold on to the others until you absolutely need them (i.e. DL 9+). By the time you realize you might want to use them, you'll have so many you'll be popping them like corn. Pop corn.

    The upper levels of Fungal Arts aren't really all that much to write home about. Mushroom Transmutation is useful, but not really worth a skill point. Battle Mycology is mildly useful on DLs 1-2, but doesn't scale well at all. The Mobile Assault Combat Mushroom is sweet until about DL6, but again, isn't really a strong endgame plan. The most useful things about the later levels of Fungal Arts are the increased mushroom procs (especially since the last level lets you spawn mushrooms without waiting around, albiet rarely.)

    All told, Fungal Arts is an amazing skill to have a couple of points in, but it's almost never the focus of a build. If you did want to focus a build around it, a Gish-type character that relied on mushrooms for healing, mana regen, and escapes while relying on it's pet (perhaps even buffing it's pet?) would be pretty fly, synergizing well with non-pet, non-healing caster classes. Which means Mathemagics, Astrology, Viking Wizardry, and Warlockery, I do believe. Actually, those four in conjunction with Staves, Dual Wield, and Fungal Arts would be pretty badass. :)
    OmniNegro likes this.
  7. Lorrelian

    Lorrelian Member

    Yes, I'm a moron. I complaetly forgot about the Hoglantern, which probably doubles the value of the skill as I originally assessed it while writing the above. =/
    Essence likes this.
  8. tejón

    tejón Member

    One major issue: pets don't appear to proc target kill buffs. This may or may not be a bug, but at least for the moment it means that your pet slime greatly reduces your mushroom harvest.
  9. Essence

    Essence Will Mod for Digglebucks

    Well, then obviously Fungal Arts needs a buff intended to be cast on your pet (targetmonster, taxa=Vegetable) that makes it buffer and adds a fungal proc to them. :D
  10. Karock

    Karock Member

    One could also say your slime IS a monster to harvest mushrooms from. =P

    Since the slime has no mana cost, it can act as a small free boost of mana, health, on kill buffs or anything else you can get from attacking a creature with no risk to you as it won't fight back. At least I believe this to be the case, so someone correct me if I am wrong.

    Just like all other pet classes, it carries the problem of slowing down combat when you use those abilities.
  11. Wootah

    Wootah Member

    You forget puffballs. They are insanely good for throwers. Even if you aren't a thrower, you can toss them to confuse groups of enemies. The Grunge ear stacks so that +3 resistance to certain resistances, which can be great in certain circumstances.

    The mushrooms are definitely the best part about the arts.
    The spore clouds do very underwhelming damage and since they are marked as mines and not clouds, they really don't do much.

    The low level slime covers you for floors 1-3 if gotten early and the spore master can take quite a few hits and i usually use it through floor 8 and as a pure distraction there after. Since it costs no mana, it is great in non-mana builds, although the long cooldown makes it hard to use it as a consistent damage sponge.
  12. Marak

    Marak Member

    I'd say one of Fungal Arts' greatest strengths is that you can use it without worrying about your current Mana or Magic Power. The Mushrooms themselves act like Potions, only more varied and numerous. Put in a point or three early on and you're good to go - you'll Mushrooms faster than you can use them (in general) and if you get to Transmute, you can turn anything you don't like or use into something you do like and use.

    Basically, if you're planning on using a build that emphasizes Heavy Armor and you know going in that your Mana pool and Magic Power are going to be non-factors, Fungal Arts is a very solid choice for your "something that can heal me faster than Food" Skill. Fairywodgers and Blungecaps can keep you going for a long time when you have solid armor and aren't taking a lot of damage in the first place.

    Other advantages include Mushrooms that don't wear off over time, so you can eat them whenever and they'll be ready for the next time you engage in combat and the ability to eat several types in succession before opening a door, so you can face the next room or three with a solid mix of buffs without having to buff up in mid-fight.
  13. Michael88

    Michael88 Member

    Can you add "wand lore" please? I don't know anything about it, and what I red at the internet is rather confusing :/ .Hoping it will be good here :)
  14. TheKirkUnited

    TheKirkUnited Member

    As crafting has been heavily reworked in the most recent free DLC, which will be released VERY soon, it might be best we wait to deal with crafting skills.

    I haven't used fungal very much but I have found mushrooms useful for all of my characters and since this guide is for newer players it might behoove us to explain why some of the the mushrooms are so useful, and by extension why fungal is so appealing.

    Inky Hoglantern gives invisibility for a few turns. Doesn't last as long as invisibility potions but still excellent for making an escape.

    Greedy Blungecap gives a vampire-like effect that heals you for a portion of the melee damage you deal, excellent for fighters.

    Fairy Wodger gives a short term regeneration effect similar to regeneration potion but a bit shorter in duration. Healing is good for everyone right? You like the heals! One of the best mushroom effects.​
    Grunge Ear buffs you with an assortment of useful damage resistances and can be stacked three times for serious protection.​
    Night Caps generate mana faster than booze. Good for any mage in a pinch.​
    Fell Truffles add 7 damage for 6 hits. Not as useful against Fell (read undead/eldritch) enemies due to their resistances.​
    The Prince, and LobsterMane Fungus add brittle buffs that make you tougher for 5 hits. Lobstery toughness can be stacked 3 times for extra toughness.​
    Azure Mob-Bonnets buff wizardly type stats and the buff can be stacked 3 times, for when you need to blow stuff up in a hurry.​
    Plumber's Agaric is the Mob-Bonnets burly cousin. Buffs your Burl and stacks 3 times.​
    Mud Wen is mostly worthless. Has limited usefulness as an alchemy reagent, but don't eat it unless you enjoy horrible stomach pain.
    All in all a very useful set of effects. Having a couple on hand is nice for any character, having fungal arts allows you to carry PILES of them. Is this not awesome?​
    Kazeto and Marak like this.
  15. tejón

    tejón Member

    Aforementioned crafting changes might buff Mud Wen? It's got potential, but it's just too hard to use right now; all the useful things you can make with it are likely to be obsolete before you can get all the pieces together. Grog as a starting recipe would help a lot.
  16. OmniaNigrum

    OmniaNigrum Member

    Fairy Wodgers stacks too. And basically makes you invulnerable in the early game if you have enough of them. I think Night Caps do too. I do not recall. I need to check the DLC and see if this has changed any.
  17. TheKirkUnited

    TheKirkUnited Member

    They may stack, I can't say, but their short duration generally prevents you from keeping the buff up except in immediate combat.
  18. Wish I knew more about the technical aspects of the skills if I did I would gladly help out. Keep up the good work people anyways I'll be sure to check back here for updates.
  19. TheKirkUnited

    TheKirkUnited Member

    You can get a summary of everything posted in this thread in the original post. Lorrelian is doing us all the service of keeping an updated .pdf.

    P.S. I really dig the sig.
  20. Marak

    Marak Member

    More Re: Fungal Arts

    Going for a semi-early 3rd point to unlock Battle Mycology seems to be the way to go. With it, you can get up to 3 Mushrooms off a single corpse, plus the chance of any kill netting you Sporification (read: a Mushroom will spawn) seems to be in the 50-75% range.

    Basically, you get more Mushrooms than you can possibly use, allowing you to keep Lobstermane, Fell Truffle, and the Prince up at all times, and giving you the freedom to add moar buffs with some combination of Plumber's Agaric, Azure Mob Bonnet, Greedy Blungecaps, Fairywodgers, Night Caps, and Grunge Ears just before opening a door.

    See closed door? Eat 3 Mushrooms, open door, proceed to kill whatever's behind it.
    Was it a Zoo? Slam the door in their faces, eat every Mushroom you have, open door, proceed to slaughter everything in sight.

    Here I am on Floor 5 - my stockpiled Mushrooms are all in my Belt slots. Keep in mind this is after eating them at random before opening doors and using 10-30 for each Zoo I come across:


    Some kind of mycological cornucopia indeed.