Any chance we can have Deadshot back?

Discussion in 'Suggestions' started by Stryke, Aug 26, 2012.

  1. Dynamod

    Dynamod Member

    I like the idea of using Accuracy and Critical for damage modifiers, especially since that didn't exist when deadshot was available, but IMO it just needs to be more snazzy. more fun. that was the problem initially, right?

    here's how I would do it:

    Tier 0 - Target Practice: Passive +3 :edr: +2:crit:, Can make Ranged attacks (thrown or Crossbow) on tiles in addition to Creatures (attacking ranged objects like statues and breakable walls) I'd better practice shooting Dredmor early while he's still a statue and can't glare menacingly at me for it. Oh wait, the statues already do that.

    Tier 1 - Trappers Trigger: Passive +2 :edr: +1 :trap_sense:, Activated ability with 24 cooldown: Forcefully trigger traps you can see. Those pressure plates make good targets as well! Who knew?!

    Tier 2 - Hand-Made Munitions: Activated ability with 30 cooldown: Transform stacks of items in your inventory randomly into low-grade thrown weapons or bolts. It takes a truly cruel mind to turn lutefisk into tactical war supplies...

    Tier 3 - Trick Shot: Passive +2 :edr:, +2 :crit:, can make Ranged attacks which go through obstructions. Something about curving the bullet? like anyone uses those things anyways.

    Tier 4 - Attention Deficit Deficiency Disorder: Activated ability with 48 cooldown: Successful attacks against the same target in a row increase your :edr:, :crit:, and :dmg_piercing: exponentially. taking any action other than attacking the focus target cancels these buffs. bonuses cap at +16 each. Please, just ADDD for short. or Ad-d-d-duh, if you're into elvish pronunciations.

    Tier 5 - Dwarven Throwing Technique: Passive +2 :melee_power:, Activated ability with 36 cooldown: Make a ranged throwing weapon attack with your melee weapon/s! So that's why they never perfected boomerangs...

    Tier 6 - Boring Shot: Passive +5 :edr:, +4 :crit:, +1 :sight: , Activated ability with 60 cooldown: A Ranged attack travel in a straight line to the end of sight, hitting targets in a line. the initial attack damage is dealt to all mobs in the way, if the attack would have any special effects they trigger at the end of the line of sight. It's actually quite interesting, once you get to know it a little.

    Total Bonuses: +12 :edr:, +8:crit:, +2:melee_power:, +1:trap_sense:, +1:sight:, Potential Accumulated Bonuses: +30:edr:, +24:crit:, +12:dmg_piercing:
    OmniNegro likes this.
  2. Rawk Hawk

    Rawk Hawk Member

    holy crap I really like that "activate trap" skill
  3. Dynamod

    Dynamod Member

    but, those ideas were just made up, not considered how difficult it would possibly be to code. ^_^;; so that might not even be possible.
  4. klaymen_sk

    klaymen_sk Member

    That tier 4 skill "Attention Deficit Deficiency Disorder" could be renamed to "Attention Deficit & Disorder", or just AD&D and you have a small reference in here.
    HenrySpock likes this.
  5. Kazeto

    Kazeto Member

    Well, right now, none of them are possible to code in; not as mods, at the very least.
    OmniNegro likes this.
  6. Dynamod

    Dynamod Member

    oh yeah, you're right! :D but the name really doesn't make sense thematically without the double negative, because attention deficit is about not being able to focus, and the skill would be about focusing your attacks. maybe rework the name a little ways... Attention Distillation & Disorder?

    yeah, wildly theoretical, but just as an example, I think if they brought it back, something along these lines would make it interesting, by making activated abilities that modify other attacks, it's still relevant as a support skill for rogues and warriors and still functions as it's own skill.
  7. Turbo164

    Turbo164 Member

    "Attention Deficitlessness & Disorderlessness"?

    If you go for that reference the flavor text should mention that your shots hit with a satisfying "THAC0!" sound (though what you have fits the original joke well ^_^ )

    All of that stuff looks great if it's possible!

    A chance to immobilize for one turn is a good ranged tree proc too, as it's not long enough to build/close distance like Lockup and Roots; all it does is keep the target at the same distance they were last turn, which helps ranged more than melee. Maybe for extra spice make it 100% chance to proc on crit (similar to Akido having a chance to proc on dodge, Shield/Warlock/Geology proccing on block etc)
  8. Kazeto

    Kazeto Member

    Which is why I proposed something simpler. They don't really have time to code all that stuff in just for one semi-abandoned skill tree, so if we want to have Deadshot in the game, it will have to be something on the level of "modding it in". Not to mention the fact that with some of the weirder abilities you proposed it would be hard to make that balanced.

    But some of your ideas are interesting for a skill tree of this calibre.
    Dynamod and OmniNegro like this.
  9. OmniaNigrum

    OmniaNigrum Member

    If we can make some really good ideas we can probably convince Gaslamp to add it back in the way we specify with a few tweaks in the ways that would be particularly hard to code. But yeah, most of this stuff cannot be done via modding at current.

    I do like the idea of triggering traps, and I know a way to do it too. When you fire, it fires a bolt. The bolt makes a invisible creature that has 1HP and dies when the trap goes off. (And dies the next turn anyway, so it does not matter if the trap did damage or not.)

    The rest I will have to think about for a while. Please break it to me gently if this is not actually possible. I do not want to cry. :(
    Dynamod likes this.
  10. Nikolai

    Nikolai Member

    I have a better way, which I currently use in my mod. A monster dying to a trap can drop things and have other unwanted side effects. So it's better to use effect type="summon" and then effect type="removemonster". This will immediately remove the monster after it spawns. I still need to make a propietary monster for this purpose, which ideally would have tons of HP and be invisible, as well as have an innate buff that continues to try to remove itself. This is so in case the monster is somehow not removed (which occasionally happens) it will get removed soon enough.

    I still wish there was an effect type for that, though. But it works.
    OmniNegro likes this.
  11. OmniaNigrum

    OmniaNigrum Member

    Just be warned that some traps target the player even if a monster stepped on them. I think there may still be some cases of this bug. But they will get ironed out soon enough.

    I like the idea Nikolai. Well done. :)
  12. Tycho

    Tycho Member

    Deadshot should be exclusive to ranged attacks, archery needs love IMO. Should focus on trick shots (blow-through/ricochets, around-the-corner, multishot), called shots (legshot, BOOM headshot) and maybe a massive spike-damage shot as capstone.

    1. Passive ability, gives ability to fire around corners and adds +1 :edr: and +1 :crit:
    @ = player, x = valid target area, o = invalid target area

    2. - activated, causes next projectile to pierce targets - 100% of one pierce, 50% of another pierce after that, 10% of a third pierce, 2% of a fourth - and if a bolt/thrown item hits a wall while it still has a pierce chance left, it will reverse its course and hit any target(s) that it hit before again. Cooldown of, say, 30 turns? Passive +1 to :edr: and :crit:. Things like flasks, BoMD, squid bolts and other things that obviously would explode/be destroyed on contact can't benefit.

    3. - activated, shot to a monster's leg/pseudopod/whatever, has +25 :edr: but does only a bolt/thrown's base damage (no bonus from :nimbleness: or :melee_power:), causes an irresistable root (does not work on fliers), cooldown of ??? 20, idk

    4. - passive - 10% chance to put a monster's eye out, causing large penalties to :edr:, :sight:, and maybe something else, idk. another passive +1 :edr: and :crit:

    5. - activated, next shot is multi-shot, flasks and BoMDs blah blah won't work. Causes you to fire 3 projectiles in rapid fire on next attack, only consumes one turn. penalty to :edr: for that shot. passive +2 :crit:. cooldown of 45 I guess. I am terrible at deciding cooldown balance

    6. - activated, next shot causes bonus damage equal to ( :edr: + :crit: / 2) and has 1% chance to kill outright. cooldown 99 turns. once again, flasks, BoMDs etc can not benefit. does not work on Vlad, Dredmor or any other boss without a random-generated name. passive +5 :edr: and +2 :crit:

    rogue archetype ability obv

    EDIT: how did I miss the original post, egad. Liking OP's suggestions too, particularly the trap-trigger
  13. OmniaNigrum

    OmniaNigrum Member

    Almost all of this would be impossible to mod in. It would take Nicholas at Gaslamp to drop everything and be tied to a terminal for ages. (And we would have to "Motivate" him with squid-deer and other abominations.) And #4 cannot work as you think since monsters have no :sight: stat.
    Kazeto likes this.
  14. Tycho

    Tycho Member

    wait, then what do they use as a counter-stat to :sneakiness:

    also, bummer
  15. lccorp2

    lccorp2 Member

    All monsters have a sight cone, and an effectiveness factor for the sight cone defined in the monDB. No monster really has any use for the sight radius stat.
  16. OmniaNigrum

    OmniaNigrum Member

    They do not. :D

    (No joking. It is true. If you have 100+ :sneakiness: then it should always work. But the RNG sometimes decides they saw you. And they never lose you once they saw you once. Not even if you had infinite :sneakiness: and walked far out of sight or moved to the other side of the level.)

    *Edit* Lccorp2 beat me ninja'ed me to it. And did a better job explaining it. :)
  17. Maze1125

    Maze1125 Member

    Okay, here's my idea based on a post Rawk Hawk made earlier in the thread. Make Deadshot into a tree that allows you to aim at specific body parts. Specifically, each level would give you a stance that, when active, would apply a debuff to an enemy every time you attacked them.

    0: Aim for the Bad Guy: Passive 3:edr: 2:crit:
    You're like, good at aiming, and stuff.

    1: Aim for the Legs: Passive 1:edr: 1:crit: gives the stance "Aim for the Legs" which applies a debuff of -25:dodge: and rooting to anything you hit.
    You've learnt to hit things in their legs, or wings, or whatever appendage they're using to try to dodge with.

    2: Aim for the Arms: Passive 1:edr: 1:crit: gives the stance "Aim for the Arms" which applies a debuff of -25:edr: -25:crit: -25:counter: -1:melee_power: to anything you hit.
    You've learnt to hit things in their arms, or tentacles, or whatever limb happens to be their favoured for assaulting you (which might actually be their legs again, but in a totally different place than the previous skill, obviously).

    3: Aim for the Chest: Passive 1:edr: 1:crit: gives the stance "Aim for the Chest" which applies a debuff of -5:life: -4:burliness: -2:armor_asorb: to anything you hit.
    You've learnt to hit things in the largest part of their body, which is obviously much harder than precisely hitting their weapon arm, obviously...

    4: Aim for the Head: Passive 1:edr: 1:crit: gives the stance "Aim for the Head" which buffs you with an extra 2:dmg_piercing: applies a debuff of -25:edr: -5:mana: -4:sagacity: -4:savvy: to anything you hit (alternatively, the debuff could apply the "dazed" effect to the target, but that might be overpowered.)
    Boom! Headshot!

    5 (capstone skill): Aim for the Eyes: Passive 3:edr: 2:crit:, gives the ability, on a 60 turn cooldown, "Aim for the Eyes" which buffs you for a single attack with 100:edr: 100:crit: 5:dmg_piercing: and applies a debuff of -100:edr: to any enemy you hit. (Obviously, this skill should deactivate any of the 4 Deadshot stances you have active, as though it were a stance itself.)
    You've become so accurate you can hit an enemy in the eyes with absolute precision, but only every once in a while...

    The main idea was to make more use of stances, by making a tree that was pretty much entirely stances. I was also trying to make a set that worked just as well for melee as ranged, all the weapons, as well as crossbows and thrown, already have their own skill trees so, in my opinion, any other tree that boosts attacks, should do so equally for everything.

    From what I know, everything here should be possible with code that's already in the game. Not sure about the numbers, they maybe entirely over, or under, -powered in their own special ways.
    OmniNegro likes this.
  18. Shwqa

    Shwqa Member

    I would like the tree back because more trees = more fun. Here is my idea for the tree:

    Tier 0: 20/20 vision- 1:sight: 2:edr: 1:trap_sense:
    Tier 1: Knee Capper- 2:edr: 2:crit: 10 turn cool down, hits one enemy for 1+(0.1*:edr:):dmg_piercing: and causes a monster to become immobile
    Tier 2: Long Distance Stance- -20:melee_power: 2:sight: 5:dmg_piercing: 5:crit: 10:edr: Causes knockback when hit.
    Tier 3: Vital Spot- 2:edr: 2:crit: 20 turn cool down, deals 5(0.5*:edr:):dmg_piercing: and 15 turn debuff that gives -3:armor_asorb::resist_piercing: -10:block::dodge::counter: -15:magic_resist:
    Tier 4: Take Aim- 4:edr: 5 turn cool down, a 1 attack brittle and 3 turn limit buff, adds 50:edr: 30:crit:
    Tier 5: In the Zone- 5:crit: Passive 5 turn buff that stacks 5 times, 2:crit: 2:edr: 1:dmg_piercing:. 100% chance to gain buff on hit.

    Basically I was hoping to make a tree that worked for warrior, rogues, and wizard builds but mostly focused on rogues.
  19. OmniaNigrum

    OmniaNigrum Member

    Knee Capper? Nope. Call it "...And that is why I stopped adventuring and became a guard." :)

    That said I like Maze1125 idea better.
  20. Kazeto

    Kazeto Member


    It is sad that a large part of people's ideas for making Deadshot seem to be along the lines of "let's make a skill tree that mostly benefits crossbows, and does it in a way that would render Archery a total crud."

    And it is also sad that most ideas are thrown around without regard to what is or is not possible now (though that one was to be expected, considering that only a small part of forum populace creates mods and thus knows enough about what can or can not be done), with only three ideas being moddable in (and one of them is monotonous, one possibly overpowered, and one likely underpowered).