ALPHA 47A ALPHA 47A NOW IN EXPERIMENTAL BRANCH

Crash from 47A attached.

 

Probably not new behaviour for 47A but has anyone noticed certain workshops like Ceramics are now using the older multiple order handling at once behaviour when it comes to using kilns?

Got a Ceramics workshop with just the overseer working in it and I noticed my brick output was surprising high, so checked it out and the one guy has like 3 loads of bricks on the go at any one time.

One starts one order, walks off to pick up clay to start a 2nd order. Starts that 2nd order, pulls out the first order, hauls it to the stockpile outside, goes to get clay for a new order and starts that, then takes out the 2nd order... if the nearest clay isn't too far away seems his peak active jobs at once seems to be around 3 kilns active at once.

Whilst it used to be lots of workshops that had compatible modules worked this way (The kitchen for example used to be able to sustain a medium sized colony with 1 worker lol), I could have sworn that the whole behaviour had been removed from all such modules and that was still the case up till at least recently.

 

If I remember correctly, the ceramics oven, as well as the charcoal and smelter still retained that property.

 

Yeah they do, it makes good sense to have multiple even for a single worker. The kitchen's Still works like that as well (brewing vat needs them to stand there and stir).

Kitchen cooking gets very fast given overseer skill. Obviously you wouldn't have any real use for Cooking Skill if all that the workers did was stick things in oven without a an action bar.

That's because it's even better than having an Expert cook, so that isn't surprising.

Nope, at least the whole last month+ it has been like this, with ovens using an action bar and the stills etc using the "golden cog" leave-and-return.

 

Had this feeling that November (R45) or sometime before the kilns and such were place and wait as well, which is why the ceramics overseer now juggling 3 orders at once took me by surprise. But I guess not then.

 

Since that's the case.

Why does putting clay into a kiln improve ceramics, while putting stuff into a smelter does not increase metalworks?

For charcoal, it's sort of obvious it probably doesn't do anything...

 

Holy Cog! You plan to make ceramics and smithing like kitchen?

I actually think this makes more sense the way it is now... that's how people actually do bricks: you mold it and leave it at the oven, coming back later to take it. That's how people do coal: just throw at the coal oven and come back when it's done. And that's also pretty much how people make gold bars...

 

Now we see the violence inherent in the system.

 

Using a wait time would probably make each module more productive than now (ie: a charcoal kiln can make more charcoal in a given length of time), however makes each colonist less productive than now.

It's an interesting thing since you really feel the gains when you are free to stock up on a ton of smelting crucibles and charcoal kilns in the metalworks and have a skeleton crew (2 people?) frantically working them all along with processing the iron ingots afterwards.

On the other hand when getting your first few bricks out, it would be faster. Currently I would recommend 2 brick kilns and 1 person, but in future, 1kiln/1person might get more done, while adding another kiln does nothing for you unless you add another worker.

Though the two types of ovens, or the three types of ceramics kilns are probably going to be about the same except in terms of repair materials?

Also, the fact that smelting doesn't increase metalworks would be amusing as you could smelt forever and never get any better at it. Similarly for charcoal, though perhaps that has a feel more of ceramics??

That is unusual, the accumulation of capital should actually increase the marginal product of skilled labor and therefore cause those skills to become more important. As all colonists can use all machines in the game, they all count as being "skilled" in this framework.

Clockwork Empires additionally follows the type of labor-enhancing human capital system, where human capital is accumulated in the intuitive "learning by doing" framework.

 

Oh yeah, actually I was going to say, wouldn't it make sense so split/meld the "action bar" type and the "leave and return" type together?

Take the brewing vat. Currently you stir and this somehow ferments your beer. Instead, why not (also for Still and Charcoal/cermics kilns).
1. Bring raw material to the vat/kiln
2. Do a "half action" (ie: action bar with half the time of standard, this is affected by overseer skill, of course)
3. Leave the module
4. Time passes (this is affected by the type of module, eg: mechanical mixing vat is faster than wooden vat)
5. Return to module
6. Do another "half action"
7. Pick up finished good, haul to stockpile.

A mechanical brewing vat, maybe even an upgraded still (take a Still and add glass + brass cog perhaps) and then the iron smelters etc would all improve the time taken in (4), overseer skill improves time taken in (2) and (6).

It's been mentioned elsewhere, but the amusing compactness of the stone smelter/kilns can make it excessively useful. why exactly are they half the size anyway?

 

Well, as we accumulate technology (which does not depreciate) in 47A one would certainly think they were liberated. Heh.

I wasn't playing at the point when the lower-class had their skills removed and just had overseers Assuming Direct Control of their skill level. Heh

 

In terms of balancing and workshop progression, the higher tier modules are gonna need a big boost, since right now they just aren't worth it for the size that they take up. Also, this also butts heads with the fact that we can't increase a building's size once it's built (Sorry Nicholas! )

 

Yeah, I shall build a super-indulgent 9x3 metalworks to hold 3 Iron Smelting Cruicibles, 3 Iron Charcoal Kilns and a Smithing Forge and Workbench. Someday, when I can go past 50 colonists and 50 days without the game starting to suffer

 

My default minimum workshop dimensions for non-kitchen industries are pretty much that already.

With the Ironworks looking like:



SP - Stockpile
D - Door
L - Loading Bay
W - Workbench
C - Charcoal
S - Smelter
F - Forge

Modules their base tech level and stockpiles set to only accept raw resources and either construction materials or produced goods/tools/weapons, depending on neighbouring workshops and how I want the placement flow to go.

Allows for moderate production across the entire duration of the colony even when at 80+ population, enough room for decor to be included to keep quality up for when colonist moods actually matter in some way.

Entry placement and module placement allows for ease of access to a module from either side of the workshop, also regardless to what side of the workshop the colonists works on they'll have a nearby stockpile to navigate to rather than one side of the workshop having a longer walk than the other half of the workshop to drop off produced goods. The recent change to workshop output hauling behaviour so they now check for the nearest stockpile as well like regular hauling did helped make the layout more practical rather than just being a purely for aesthetics.

With loading bay production being buggered about with since the module construction system change, have been drawn toward the idea of losing the loading bays and shifting the workspace down to 4 deep instead, that or keep the workfloor 5 deep and use standard doors for access, but they don't look nearly as cool with colonists loading/unloading goods into bays through... and the incentive to keep producing more to keep the loading bays does have a nice byproduct of encouraging continuous overseer immigration with little downtime period.

So the idea of a 9x3 being 'super-indulgent' made me giggle.

 

Yes that's because you only have 2 smelter, 2 charcoal, and aren't using the large modules.

I mean a nice row of massive iron smelting cruicibles (3 of them) on one side and then a row of 3 iron charcoal kilns on the other.

I don't tend to have very much empty space or more than one door. Though it is an Upper Class door (2 planks, how indulgent)

I know you already saw the Building Buildings (and Modules) thread so sure...

EDIT: Oh I didn't realise you might have been playing the ironic line there, since my non 2x2s are like wonderful houses (supercrammed hellish paradises), kitchens (factories with lines of ovens) and the metalworks (a blazing inferno of crucibles and kilns)

 

Clay Pots are instantly produced.